Srikanth, 200 cr/month is what our sources said we would see *at least* meaning it could be more. We would know the true scale of frauds if everyone in the ecosystem payments apps, banks, NPCI, police have a unified picture of the scale. We don't have that today. Plus 50% UPI transactions are under Rs 500, so the value will never be as much as credit/debit card frauds. All this to say, as a proportion of total transactions frauds via UPI will never seem like an issue, until you see it in isolation. Also, the question here is as % of scams, how big is this. And for that a govt official says that 50% of fin serv frauds are via UPI. That's not something one can ignore. This coupled with the fact that reported scams are only 20% of what actually happens. This makes it important. Agree with your hacks for safety.

Arundhati Ramanathan

It's not that it can't be traced, but it takes more time. The police need to contact the bank for the bank account number. The user doesn't know the bank acct details when they are making a UPI transfer. Banks take time to respond, by the time the fraudster has emptied the bank account since these are real time settlements.

Arundhati Ramanathan

In the first line of the story we say orchestrated via UPI. When we say UPI transactions are 4.5 bln we are in awe of the volume of trnxn that end up via UPI; the same applies for frauds too that are seen on the platform where end point of these scam is in UPI.

Arundhati Ramanathan

Sure, thanks for the tip Ramraj. Will definitely take a look at Aavas.

Arundhati Ramanathan

Sunil, Navi is positioning experience and low rates as its USP, but as you point out and we also argue in the piece, those are not enough to make it in this segment. But it is compelled to enter this space because its ability to raise more capital at a good credit rating depends on a diversified book.

Arundhati Ramanathan

Thank you Triparna. For sure, he ll have to raise external debt. They are an NBFC so no, regulatory-wise nothing bars them.

Arundhati Ramanathan

I could not find that data on loans transferred out, Srikanth. For sure, I think account aggregation can easily crunch the time taken for the process.

Arundhati Ramanathan

According to the user I spoke to, his apprehensions were coming from things like when coming to prepayment or balance of transfers it wont be a seamless process, and would be riddled with onerous processes

Arundhati Ramanathan

I don't disagree with you at all, Ramraj. In fact thats why we chose to write this article on why Navi is choosing to take on this extremely hard segment. I understand, even the likes of RBL and IndusInd too entered home loan later in life. Though arduous, Navi is in a way compelled to enter this space. To raise more money at a decent credit rating, they'll need a diversified loan book of significant scale with low defaults. Home loans help there. I agree its going to be extremely hard for them to execute this just on experience, which as you rightly point out will be commoditised. But this is is what we conclude as well-- that this is going to be a tightrope walk. About your point on anecdote: I understand your point of view. And two or 100 is still going to be just anecdotes. But we still like to talk to users because it helps to see how users are experiencing or using or thinking about a product. It also helps readers relate or completely disagree with the point of view ( like you feel today). The anecdote therefore serves that purpose of helping readers pick where they stand. So IMHO, it is an important reporting/writing device to add another important dimension to the piece.

Arundhati Ramanathan

Yes that's right, Srikanth.

Arundhati Ramanathan

Do let me know how that experience goes Sudarshan. AFAIK, most of Navi's HL is from new loans and not balance transfers. Lenders make it awfully hard and unattractive to do a balance transfer.

Arundhati Ramanathan

These are not my assumptions, Sreejith. This is the user's thinking. Home loan is a 15-yr engagement, the user we spoke to doesn't want to be locked in that long with a PSU. Some of the HFCs offered a terrible user experience he said, so he didn't want that either. These are his views, nothing wrong or right about it. Not sure why presenting what a user feels is a weak start.

Arundhati Ramanathan